[Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [01:05:13] Unirse dsal se ha unido a este canal (~Adium@111.93.131.5). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [01:11:09] Unirse Mook se ha unido a este canal (~mook@adsl-71-138-143-17.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [01:12:00] Salir H__ ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [01:12:46] Unirse H__ se ha unido a este canal (H__@lambermont.dyndns.org). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [02:35:47] Salir Caemyr ha dejado este servidor (Quit: Exit... stage right). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [02:55:50] Salir zooko ha dejado este servidor (Quit: Zzz...). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [03:26:27] Unirse benallard se ha unido a este canal (~benallard@ip51cd8985.speed.planet.nl). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [03:55:39] Unirse Caemyr se ha unido a este canal (~ni-chu@reactos/tester/Caemyr). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [04:48:00] Unirse AmineKhaldi_ se ha unido a este canal (~AmineKhal@reactos/tester/BZMaintainer). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [04:51:37] Salir AmineKhaldi ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [04:58:39] Unirse Almad se ha unido a este canal (~almad@phoenix.chservices.cz). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [05:15:26] Salir Mook ha dejado este servidor (Quit: zzz). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [06:58:54] Salir TheUni ha dejado este servidor (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [06:59:14] Unirse TheUni se ha unido a este canal (~quassel@xbmc/staff/theuni). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [08:01:55] Unirse matsl se ha unido a este canal (~matsl@94.136.75.10). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [10:25:46] djmitche: you there? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [10:42:18] Salir LRN ha dejado este servidor (Read error: Connection reset by peer). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [10:43:10] Unirse LRN se ha unido a este canal (~L_R_N@host-81.200.2.147.su29.ru). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [11:21:07] Salir Almad ha dejado este servidor (Remote host closed the connection). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [11:25:37] Abandonar matsl ha dejado este canal ("Leaving"). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [11:44:16] Salir dsal ha dejado este servidor (Quit: Leaving.). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [11:54:41] Salir Caemyr ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:15:13] Unirse Caemyr se ha unido a este canal (~ni-chu@reactos/tester/Caemyr). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:25:08] Unirse Haos se ha unido a este canal (~ni-chu@nat.urpl.gov.pl). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:25:49] Salir Caemyr ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:30:31] Salir Haos ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:58:54] maruel: well, today :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [12:59:14] djmitche is ducking catlee's requests for a release :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:00:56] no, I just forgot about movienight last night [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:01:00] so, indirectly, I blame warner ;) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:03:37] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:04:03] I'll do it now tho [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:04:15] joduinn never sent out call-in info did he? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:04:16] hrm [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:04:54] no but is there a discussion plan? I just want to know if it's relevant to me [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:05:37] he sure didn't [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:15:42] maruel: the two major points are to decide what goes into 0.8.1 (and who will do it) and what we're just not going to do [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:15:55] with a review of new features in 0.8.0 too [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:19:02] maruel: I'd very much like to have you there, since integrating some of google's developent would be great in 0.8.1 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:33:39] Unirse Mook_sb se ha unido a este canal (~mook@204.16.157.66). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:41:00] Salir TheUni ha dejado este servidor (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:41:38] Unirse TheUni se ha unido a este canal (~quassel@xbmc/staff/theuni). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:54:34] Salir LRN ha dejado este servidor (Read error: Connection reset by peer). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:58:06] Unirse github-buildbot se ha unido a este canal (~github-bu@sh1-ext.rs.github.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:58:07] buildbot: 07master 03Dustin J. Mitchell * 54b7fc6 (1 files in 1 dirs): update NEWS [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:58:07] buildbot: 07master 03Dustin J. Mitchell * 9d2fd33 (1 files in 1 dirs): add buildbot.test.util [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:58:07] buildbot: 07master commits 8b6b1b3...9d2fd33 - http://bit.ly/92xwDp [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [13:58:07] Abandonar github-buildbot ha dejado este canal. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:00:00] Unirse github-buildbot se ha unido a este canal (~github-bu@sh1-ext.rs.github.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:00:01] buildbot: 07buildbot-0.8.0 03Dustin J. Mitchell * de00b67 (1 files in 1 dirs): update VERSION to 0.8.0rc1 - http://bit.ly/ctrGR9 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:00:01] Abandonar github-buildbot ha dejado este canal. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:02:19] oooh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:03:59] woohoo! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:06:06] please ignore the part where I released buildbot-0.8.1rc1 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:06:16] apparently, the words "buildbot" and "0.8.0" are difficult for me to type [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:07:08] Unirse warner se ha unido a este canal (~user@nat/mozilla/x-sowreyqyqqcsuemc). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:07:09] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:10:46] maybe I should work for a company with short product names [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:10:50] like Amazon: S3, EC2, etc. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:12:03] Unirse LRN se ha unido a este canal (~L_R_N@host-81.200.2.147.su29.ru). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:20:01] http://buildbot.net/trac/wiki/Meeting29April2010 <-- comments? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:20:30] djmitche: when did the behaviour of the source steps change to report the full hash as got_revision? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:20:46] what are the first two items, specifically? an overview of those things? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:20:58] and who's going to talk about them? :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:21:11] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:40:23] catlee: not sure what you mean? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:40:27] in git? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:41:13] djmitche: nm, I might be lying [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:41:15] bhearsum: I want to start with a common understanding of where we are in 0.8.0 - what's finished, what's still got interesting work to do [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:42:09] ok, i wasn't quite sure if it was "here's what's new section" or a "let's discuss the new features" thing [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:45:15] yeah, sorry, the agenda itself is at the bottom [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:46:40] oh, ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:50:26] anyone have thoughts on http://buildbot.net/trac/ticket/809 ? (has to do with priority of different sources of BuildProperty's) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:52:02] I don't understand the bug... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:52:36] unless he's saying that first the request properties get applied, and then the change properties? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:52:51] yeah, i think that's what he's saying [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [14:52:53] bhearsum: I agree with your comment [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:07:38] djmitche: yeah, sometime since 0.7.10 hg has started reporting long revisions for got_revision [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:08:48] maruel: thanks, gtk [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:09:00] catlee: "reporting" = appear in web status, or is it using incorrect revisions somehow? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:09:18] djmitche: no, it's correct [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:09:36] djmitche: it's just using the full revision, whereas before it used the short one [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:10:33] why is that bad? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:10:41] now that the web status trims revisions nicely.. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:10:59] things that generate filenames based on revision [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:11:04] it's not bad [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:11:06] it's just a change [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:11:48] ah, ok, hmm [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:12:05] I suppose it could become an option [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:15:37] yeah...that's a bit of a pain to support too [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:15:47] anyway, might be worth a mention in CHANGES? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:16:00] 4ea40fc57a66f72652e83a7224a9c2c621c6bb8b [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:16:46] ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:17:28] Unirse Caemyr se ha unido a este canal (~ni-chu@reactos/tester/Caemyr). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:18:58] Unirse chrisp se ha unido a este canal (~c0960ac8@gateway/web/freenode/x-xwtkogbrbmjcqotv). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:19:49] Unirse github-buildbot se ha unido a este canal (~github-bu@sh1-ext.rs.github.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:19:50] buildbot: 07master 03Dustin J. Mitchell * caf99ac (0 files in 0 dirs): remove spurious file [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:19:50] buildbot: 07master 03Dustin J. Mitchell * 39c1a74 (1 files in 1 dirs): add news about mercurial revision ids [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:19:50] buildbot: 07master commits 9d2fd33...39c1a74 - http://bit.ly/98YgxW [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:19:50] Abandonar github-buildbot ha dejado este canal. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:20:18] Unirse github-buildbot se ha unido a este canal (~github-bu@sh1-ext.rs.github.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:20:19] buildbot: 07buildbot-0.8.0 03Dustin J. Mitchell * ff313e4 (0 files in 0 dirs): remove spurious file ... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:20:19] buildbot: 07buildbot-0.8.0 03Dustin J. Mitchell * c512b5b (1 files in 1 dirs): add news about mercurial revision ids ... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:20:19] buildbot: 07buildbot-0.8.0 commits de00b67...c512b5b - http://bit.ly/c0gzAW [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:20:19] Abandonar github-buildbot ha dejado este canal. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:27:31] hmm, mozilla folks: where should I park? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:27:40] last time I came by was after business hours [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:27:50] don't ask me... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:28:40] I'm on the other wise of the universe [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:28:42] yeah, or bhearsum :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:28:55] other side... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:29:14] I know there's a lot under the building [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:30:17] yeah, I'm just not sure if that's legit during working hours [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:30:18] I'll figure it out.. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:30:26] hear y'all soon [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:31:28] apparently street parking isn't bad [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:31:49] otherwise there's a public lot just off that roundabout thingy behind the office [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [15:32:14] we don't let strange people into the lot underground apparently [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:03:16] Unirse Pike_mobile se ha unido a este canal (~user@brln-4d0c3ac9.pool.mediaWays.net). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:03:36] Unirse armenzg se ha unido a este canal (~armenzg@mozca02.ca.mozilla.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:04:30] are we using this as backchannel or some other channel? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:04:35] this AFAIK [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:04:43] * Pike_mobile is otp [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:04:46] meeting notes: http://buildbot.net/trac/wiki/Meeting29April2010 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:05:02] n810-style [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:05:07] Unirse bear se ha unido a este canal (~bear@c-71-230-97-250.hsd1.pa.comcast.net). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:06:01] Unirse asasaki se ha unido a este canal (~asasaki@people.mozilla.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:06:07] video should be here: http://air.mozilla.com/ [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:06:50] Unirse lsblakk se ha unido a este canal (~lsblakk@people.mozilla.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:06:51] crash bang boom? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:07:44] Unirse Rail se ha unido a este canal (~rail@mozca02.ca.mozilla.com). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:07:45] Unirse rhelmer se ha unido a este canal (~rhelmer@64.9.242.11). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:07:52] hey there, rhelmer! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:07:56] hey! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:07:57] hey bhearsum [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:02] is that dustin talking? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:07] i am in mv [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:10] oh, cool [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:10] yes [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:19] he's cutting out a bit [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:26] should the air video be working? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:08:35] chrisp: stil lworking on it AFAIK [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:09:05] voice dialin backup? skype? ustream feed from laptop on someone's lap? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:09:25] dustin: talk a little louder? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:09:35] chrisp: hit *6669 to turn the volume up for you [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:09:46] stream.ogg gives 404 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:09:53] bhear: thanks [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:10:06] and the page retries every two seconds or so... poor server [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:10:59] chrisp: np [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:04] PovAddict: heh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:04] enjoy guy, unfortunately I have other obligations, If you can record it, I'll be glad to replay it, keep us posted. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:05] *1 to unmute [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:07] that's by design :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:27] wow - volume is *low* [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:37] is the mic too far? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:11:40] bear: *6669 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:12:05] oohhh - much better [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:12:18] Unirse mozPike se ha unido a este canal (~chatzilla@brln-4d0c3ac9.pool.mediaWays.net). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:12:49] can't hear whomever is talking [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:12:54] warner [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:12:57] Salir benallard ha dejado este servidor (Quit: benallard). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:05] warner: talk louder! ;-) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:11] thanks dustin [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:13] Salir Pike_mobile ha dejado este servidor (Quit: Leaving). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:25] hardly [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:43] mozPike: *6669 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:13:58] mumble mumble [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:04] hmm [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:05] someone isn't muted [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:12] better? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:15] ah, better! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:21] yes! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:29] gtk [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:33] toronto will keep muted :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:14:44] Unirse joduinn-mac se ha unido a este canal (~joduinn@nat/mozilla/x-casffkvdvfpggwjp). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:16:53] split the master into scheduler and event-handler? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:18:49] toronto mute again? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:18:54] presumably, there could be a built in configuration (--simple?) if you want everything all in one [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:18:56] I guess that's still warner that's hard to hear, right ? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:18:58] thanks [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:19:10] which would setup a simple status receiver in the database, or w/e [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:19:14] Unirse Sly_Squash se ha unido a este canal (~buildbot@greed.cs.ohiou.edu). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:19:37] yea, --simple would be unified master using internal listener/handler for events [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:19:42] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:19:59] mozPike yeah, that was bwarner [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:20:15] it makes a lot of sense for large projects, but it really complicates things for simple, small things [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:21:07] mozPike is that better? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:21:23] secondary status only database becomes a custom listener with it's own mirror of the db [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:21:37] anybody taking minutes? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:21:38] * bhearsum nods to this [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:21:44] (to warner) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:30] maybe we're taping this? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:44] supposedly we are [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:50] joduinn-mac: yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:54] Whois mozPike es ~chatzilla@brln-4d0c3ac9.pool.mediaWays.net (Axel Hecht) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:55] Whois mozPike es usuario en los canales: #buildbot [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:55] Whois mozPike está conectado vía farmer.freenode.net (Chesterbrook, PA, USA). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:55] Whois mozPike ha estado inactivo desde hace 5 segundos. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:55] Whois mozPike ha estado conectado desde 2010-04-29 16:11:56. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:55] Whois Fin de la lista WHOIS. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:22:58] sure -- you could have a second process which listens for status that starts with the build master [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:23:52] * mozPike mumbles logserver, wishful thinking [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:26:18] woohoo, video! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:26:21] almost... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:26:45] chrisp we are streaming this at air.mozilla.com; I'll post an ogg file someplace afterwards. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:26:56] is xml-rpc used? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:27:02] * joduinn-mac just had to kick one of the video systems to restart the stream [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:27:15] jsonrpc? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:27:23] eh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:27:39] it was working earlier, so not sure how much got dropped [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:27:50] who's that talking? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:28:20] murali [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:28:22] murali? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:28:36] ah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:28:43] thx [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:29:35] in case people cannot read dustin's screen, you can read it here: http://buildbot.net/trac/wiki/Meeting29April2010 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:29:50] topic that? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:30:09] Aviso -ChanServ- Channel #buildbot is not registered. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:30:16] mozPike: we have no control over the channel topic [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:30:55] * mozPike giggles [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:30:56] mozPike: "only ops can set topic" was set on latest freenode server upgrade, and channel is not registered so nobody can become op [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:31:46] there are auth issues to figure out with xmlrpc/json [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:32:13] http auth? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:32:28] ssl certs? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:32:40] I see no advantage to shutting down the master remotely [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:02] maruel: what happens if you have a cluster of 10 masters you want to shut down ? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:06] probably only useful in large scale implementations [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:11] mozPike: I requested to register this channel months ago [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:14] a PITA to do if you need to log on to 10 machines :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:15] bhearsum: you ssh in [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:21] to 10 machines? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:26] it's not really scriptable [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:28] yes it is [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:29] bhearsum: ssh, "make restart" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:39] PovAddict: not the same way over-the-web is [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:33:59] for host in foo bar baz; do ssh user@$host make restart; done [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:34:05] it's scriptable, we do. But we host most master on a limited number of servers [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:34:48] yeah, but _nicer_ if there's an API for it [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:34:57] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:35:22] sure, I won't block you from merging changes :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:35:49] "I've got a great idea for a new [X]. Let's take [existing protocol] and implement it over HTTP!" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:36:06] PovAddict: *shrug* [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:36:16] i'd be just as happy if it were controllable over the slave port [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:36:30] but doing it over http let's you use existing tools to do auth and control [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:37:25] one thing I wanted the latent build slave to do was to prevent me from having to list out each slave individually [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:37:45] using http permits traversing firewall [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:16] I never really understood that argument [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:26] PovAddict: try working for a very large company [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:30] PovAddict: well, you want to put slaves inside your corporate firewall [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:36] catlee: one thing i have been doing with cloud-style servers is give them names that can be traversed as a graph [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:36] PovAddict: and have them punch out to talk to the master [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:38:45] PovAddict: so they can accept arbitrary code to execute -- inside your corporate firewall [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:39:22] so why would the firewall admins want to let you do the same thing enveloped in HTTP? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:39:32] because they don't know anything about security [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:39:41] they just know that firewalls create it magically out of nothing [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:39:56] but firewalls have to let http through, otherwise no one can read their email [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:40:00] QED [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:40:24] catlee: (re: not listing out each slave individually, not sure if that addresses that though) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:40:25] I disagree with putting too many stuff in sourcestamp [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:40:52] i think there needs to be a way to express a build which is made up of many Source's [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:22] sometimes different sources from different types of repositories [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:24] rhelmer: I don't quite get what you mean [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:51] bhearsum: then you need a meta checkout tool [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:56] catlee: i may have misread your statement [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:57] catlee: i assumed you meant you want to not have to get a "master list" of all available nodes [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:57] what do you mean? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:41:59] (like gclient, repo, etc) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:42:13] with versionned stuff [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:42:20] svn and git support that natively too [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:42:30] svn:external and .gitsubmodules [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:42:37] rhelmer: yeah, I want to be able to say, here's my EC2 key, spin up up to N nodes. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:43:43] catlee: yeah i have been doing that kind of thing with the ec2 tools from shell, but been moving to python/libcloud [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:44:21] you can do it kind of like a thread pool, or the simpler "one node, one job" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:44:27] and other clever ways i am sure [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:45:58] * joduinn-mac had to restart the video stream; sadly it had borked out and stopped recording at some point. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:46:11] it is now streaming, and recording, again [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:48:30] maruel: we've been using the prioritization hooks for that in some ways [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:48:57] ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:49:41] djmitche: we can set up a 'try' area for buildbot [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:49:50] is djmitche reading this? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:03] * maruel laugh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:14] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:25] catlee: I don't think he's reading [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:35] catlee: try would be doable [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:46] on the same master in fact [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:48] we have a bunch of machines ready to go I think [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:51:52] "it would be a good integration test" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:53:53] * catlee wants dumb slaves [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:54:03] ~me too [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:54:48] we need better tools for composite steps maybe [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:55:18] for conditional steps... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:55:46] i'm not sure about conditional steps [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:55:59] yes [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:00] yes it is [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:01] if you need a conditional step, you should consider moving that logic into a script [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:10] (eg, your build system) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:42] kinda hard if its only about if "build failed" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:49] or if "previous step failed" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:56:58] Caemyr: that can be wrapped in the build system [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:57:13] * exarkun coughs [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:57:18] * bear chuckles [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:57:37] bhearsum: buildsystem is not mine [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:57:46] exarkun: you run twisted on your phone? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:57:54] no my phone only runs java [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:00] Caemyr: that's fair -- you could wrap it though, couldn't you? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:08] i dont think so [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:20] * bhearsum tries hard to remove complexity from BuildFactory's these days [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:38] Yes please buffer logs on the slave [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:45] bhearsum: yours is a real mess [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:45] well, we buffer now [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:47] 64kb/5s [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:49] maruel: no kidding! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:51] bhearsum: Since when? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:58:56] exarkun: a month or so ago [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:00] catlee wrote that patch [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:02] bhearsum: So no released version of buildbot? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:09] nope [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:12] 0.8.0 will have it [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:18] Okay. Well, cool. I'm excited for the time when some of my slaves have that feature. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:39] exarkun: yeah, buffering in memory is in 0.8.0 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:50] will 0.8.0 slaves talk to 0.7.12 masters? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [16:59:57] i think so [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:00:36] bhearsum: unfortunately i need to avoid tinkering with BE i use [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:00:41] ah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:01:20] well, not a problem now, iirc [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:01:48] huh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:01:51] what flag is that? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:02:04] i got a trunk on multiple builders prepped and stable, gonna move to triggering tests and adding branches [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:02:13] as long as I can keep my realtime log [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:02:44] I'd wish the log transfer was more timing based than "chunk I just got" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:03] mozPike: in which way? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:19] mozPike: the slave-side buffering now happens based on a timer [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:31] catlee: buffer for 5 or 10 secs, or some buffer size, and then transmit [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:36] oh, it does? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:40] didn't look in a while [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:52] that's the feature they were just explaining to me :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:03:58] it's 5s or 64kb, whichever comes first, right? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:04:09] yeah, something like that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:04:18] forget the exact values [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:04:40] I say no to to GUIs [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:05:01] what's happening in the back? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:08:43] could people introduce themselves when they speak? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:01] it would be great help to match voices to irc-nick [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:15] 2 voices ago was maruel [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:27] hi [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:33] is this catlee now? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:35] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:37] oui [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:41] hey there - yep, catlee now [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:49] and before maruel was the google person? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:54] ...and thats murali [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:09:56] yes [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:10:02] maruel is the google person [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:11:12] this is maruel [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:12:28] yes, watch for wrong pronounciation [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:12:36] s/yes/easy/ [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:12:53] :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:15:08] Generating configuration is a natural side-effect of GUI configuration though. Hey, didn't someone write a GUI configurator for buildbot? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:15:20] Also, Twisted is great, and you can have a function that runs for the entire lifetime of the process if you want it to. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:15:27] here's what I was referring to: [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:15:30] djmitche is an evil liar. I will depose him. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:15:31] http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/WebKitTools/BuildSlaveSupport/build.webkit.org-config/config.json [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:16:10] thanks maruel [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:16:20] is the interpreter for that in public too? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:16:29] well, it's relatively simple to have a master.cfg that reads a DSL to create the dictionary with schedulers, builders, etc. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:16:41] no need to write out python code directly [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:16] oh, nm, the interpreter is right there [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:22] +1 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:23] bhearsum: the interpreter is ridiculously simple inside master.cfg beside config.json [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:29] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:34] that's like a micro version of our monster [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:40] +1 to remote shell access [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:17:42] (except ours is fed by a big dict) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:18:21] all of these ideas for community supplied slaves are very interesting [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:18:22] see loadBuilderConfig(c) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:18:47] in http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/WebKitTools/BuildSlaveSupport/build.webkit.org-config/master.cfg [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:10] I prefer python file to json though, easier to hand edit [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:27] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:50] here's how we define our slaves: [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:52] http://src.chromium.org/viewvc/chrome/trunk/tools/buildbot/master.tryserver/slaves.cfg?view=markup [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:54] http://hg.mozilla.org/build/buildbot-configs/file/tip/mozilla2/config.py [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:19:56] we do one per master [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:21:04] "commit" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:21:28] who was just talking? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:21:44] yay for split [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:21:57] would love to have a slave that doesn't require twisted [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:22:19] catlee: your config.py file could be a bit more declarative [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:22:43] oh my skype ran out of dollars right at "berkeley" [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:00] But I know the answer anyway, berkeley db is crap, never use it for anything [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:04] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:20] yes, I've had nothing but problems with berkeley db [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:33] bigtable works fine :D [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:42] bdb python bindings are horrible [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:23:59] maruel: can we all get access to bigtable? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:16] bear: or possibly worse than that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:21] yes, with hadoop :P [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:29] (or GAE) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:37] who's talking now? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:38] exarkun - I was being polite [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:41] also, now that oracle owns it, it's probably doubly worth avoiding [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:50] is that Brian? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:24:59] bhearsum: warner is holding the mike [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:25:04] ah, ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:25:15] bhearsum: yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:25:50] maruel: how so? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:25:55] (re: declarative) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:26:51] catlee: statements likes: BRANCHES['places']['platforms']['linux64']['update_platform'] = 'fake' [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:27:00] you could rewrite as a dict [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:27:14] ah yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:27:18] it is a dict [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:27:42] I wonder if you guys should use gtalk conference or if it'd fail horribly [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:27:52] catlee: I know but you use statements instead of declarations [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:28:29] maruel: yeah, I forget why.... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:28:54] catlee: probably started small and then copy'n'paste [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:29:28] +1 to warner [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:29:55] beta, I know that! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:30:07] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:09] only if we could kill child processes on windows with twisted... :D [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:18] +1 to what warner said [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:19] we have a patch for that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:36] maruel: http://hg.mozilla.org/users/catlee_mozilla.com/twisted/rev/510653655551 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:37] * joduinn-mac not shy about 0.8.2, 0.8.3, etc.... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:31:38] that was me, btw [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:01] I think that's the one... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:14] catlee: we can't use that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:19] release early, release often, release regularly [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:31] +1 to that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:37] nooo don't wait for "almost done" features [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:46] there's always another "almost done" feature [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:32:48] i think that's alright, within limits [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:12] that just means using git branches more [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:14] just pick an interval and release on it [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:14] yeah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:15] if you'd have waited for json and status push to be stable, you'd wait for years :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:23] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:32] if you have regular releases, it's not all that scary to have your feature miss a release [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:36] because you know there's another one coming [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:40] that's very true. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:33:50] that model has worked well for Firefox Alphas/Betas [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:22] but then you start having feature branches, which isn't fun either [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:27] why not? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:35] feature branches are great IMHO [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:40] it keeps your trunk stable [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:44] ok, we don't use them [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:47] we could! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:54] s/we/chromium/ [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:34:56] oh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:08] I agree that feature branches are great [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:21] oh crap - i've been unmasked! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:22] They might not necessarily be great for *every* project, but I'm pretty sure they'd be great for buildbot [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:27] * bear hides his secret PR cape and mask [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:43] exarkun: heh, twisted has one per bug, don't they? :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:56] something like that [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:35:58] * bhearsum volunteered for releases, not windows! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:36:11] sometimes there's just a patch, if it's developed by someone without svn access [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:36:26] and sometimes there's 6 branches for one bug, because svn's not very good at merging. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:36:30] * joduinn-mac could never imagine bhearsum volunteering on windows !!! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:36:34] warner - do you want me to reprise my windows help role? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:38:49] I just need to figure out to setup a dmz on my backup isp connection... [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:39:01] but if moz can give a few, it's fine too :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:17] joduinn doing his best to make everyone jealous [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:23] foooood [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:27] put it up on camera [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:33] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:44] heh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:40:53] i think i can get one into a scanner [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:02] is this a public viewing? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:04] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:28] Salir asasaki ha dejado este servidor (Quit: leaving). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:30] it could have been worse and used chrome [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:37] seriously! [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:41:38] jeesh [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:42:35] lol [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:43:39] Salir bear ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:44:27] djmitche: i'd love to get a braindump of "what happens for a release" sometime [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:45:23] Salir rhelmer ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:48:00] Unirse bear se ha unido a este canal (~bear@c-71-230-97-250.hsd1.pa.comcast.net). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:53:32] maybe in a year I could host in mtv (and be there this time) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [17:55:04] (I assume everyone is eating now) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:01:06] I'm done eating ;-) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:01:14] we're going to eat soon :) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:06:47] catlee: I think I'll upstream some parts of my slaves.py script [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:06:54] along with something similar used by webkit [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:07:12] maruel: cool [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:07:22] maruel: I didn't really see what they were doing [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:07:27] I don't know how it would fit your setup [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:07:38] (probably not at all) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:07:47] is there anything extractable on your side? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:12:23] in what ways? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:15:49] the code that parses the BRANCHES dict [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:16:18] that's big and ugly [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:16:35] very specific to what we're doing [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:17:04] ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:17:06] http://hg.mozilla.org/build/buildbotcustom/file/tip/misc.py#l323 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:17:59] http://hg.mozilla.org/build/buildbot-configs/file/daec2af2f26b/mozilla2/master1.cfg#l20 [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:19:12] ok [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:20:31] Salir Rail ha dejado este servidor (Quit: 0.3.1.1). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:23:12] mozPike: for ticket #809, are you saying that you want the scheduler to create a 'locale' property on the request which includes one or more of the 'locale's from the changes? [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:25:34] Salir armenzg ha dejado este servidor (Quit: armenzg). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:32:11] catlee: or overwrite, yeah. Like, for the weave setup, we'll get changes with 'locale' being set to 'en-US', for which I want to build all locales, setting the locale in question in the build request in the scheduler [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:32:52] ah [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:45:00] mozPike: yeah, if the change properties couldn't override the request properties, or maybe if they were just applied in the other order, that would make sense [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:48:47] * warner gets back to his desk [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:49:16] bear: yeah, if you've got the bandwidth to get involved in windows+buildbot work, that'd be awesome [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [18:54:23] warner - cool [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [19:13:44] Salir chrisp ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [19:42:28] Salir AmineKhaldi_ ha dejado este servidor (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [20:39:37] Unirse Se ha unido al canal #buildbot (~nicolas@synecdoche/developer/povaddict). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [20:39:37] Tema El tema del canal es «Buildbot-0.7.12 | docs: http://djmitche.github.com/buildbot/docs/0.7.12/ | buildbot.net». [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [20:39:37] Tema El tema fue establecido por djmitche!~dustin@99.89.149.20 en 2010-02-01 20:23. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [20:40:33] Modo Modos del canal: +nst [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [20:40:34] Creado Este canal fue creado el 2010-01-30 04:48. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:00:40] Unirse Se ha unido al canal #buildbot (~nicolas@synecdoche/developer/povaddict). [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:00:40] Tema El tema del canal es «Buildbot-0.7.12 | docs: http://djmitche.github.com/buildbot/docs/0.7.12/ | buildbot.net». [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:00:40] Tema El tema fue establecido por djmitche!~dustin@99.89.149.20 en 2010-02-01 20:23. [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:01:17] anyone have today's IRC logs as a text file they can send me really easily? (and I do mean *really*) [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:01:38] Modo Modos del canal: +nst [Jueves 29 Abril 2010] [21:01:38] Creado Este canal fue creado el 2010-01-30 04:48.