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[04:56] <Schroeder> actually, as the eminent 20th-century Russian-American philosopher Ayn Rand proved, it's the most moral statement a man can make
[04:56] <ThinkMedical> i cannot believe that you think 'what a person will accept' is alway fair
[04:56] <Schroeder> because it is indeed fair
[04:57] <Schroeder> please explain how it's unfair
[04:57] <Schroeder> please explain how your opinion is more important than the opinions of the people actually involved in the transaction
[04:57] <itrebal> wow
[04:57] <Schroeder> you're a megalomaniac, plain and simple
[04:57] <kafteinn> so if we brainwash a class of people into believing they love to be slaves, we should do that?
[04:57] <ThinkMedical> ok a rich child would not have to work for $1/hor
[04:57] <itrebal> philosophy in ##php... ThinkMedical you've dropped to a new plane I didn't think possible
[04:57] <ThinkMedical> a poor child does
[04:57] <ThinkMedical> the transaction iteself may be devoid of outward imposed morality
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[04:58] <ThinkMedical> but comparing necessities from one group to another we can see what's fair
[04:58] <ThinkMedical> the poor have to work for less, that's what makes them poor; often because of bad education because their parents are poor
[04:59] <ThinkMedical> so the prolitariate doesnt chage size considerably from one generation to the next
[04:59] <cythrawll> "don't try to tell me how power can corrupt a person, you never had any to know what it's like"
[05:00] <ThinkMedical> because of a socially-enforced class system by which basic human needs of education, health and the means to have a good life are 'voluntary transactions'
[05:00] <ThinkMedical> which cannot be engauged in most of the time because of the system itself
[05:00] <kafteinn> but we can't let everyone who is ever going to be born to have a good life?
[05:00] <ThinkMedical> no
[05:00] <ThinkMedical> we can only look after those in our country, state, etc.
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[05:00] <kafteinn> but that's nationalism really
[05:01] <ThinkMedical> it is, but until we can really get the middle class to care about other countries its the best there is
[05:01] <kafteinn> altough I agree with it.. you should care for you and your family or extended family
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[05:02] <ThinkMedical> in the UK housing,healthcare,basic amenties are free providing you are working or trying to
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[05:02] <kafteinn> really the only thing anyone should think of other countries is hope there will be less of them in the future.. but this is ofcourse conducive to a lot of fighting
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[05:02] <ThinkMedical> you also get help to ensure youre children have this too, inlcuding food water etc.
[05:02] <cythrawll> yeah but they don't have any guns :<
[05:02] <ThinkMedical> education etc.
[05:02] <cythrawll> how do they shoot people?
[05:02] <kafteinn> here also in Iceland
[05:03] <ThinkMedical> so the government provides a way out of the underclass via education, sustained with healthcare and provision of housing and food
[05:03] <ThinkMedical> that is, or ought to be, the central role of a government